Re: [PATCH] maint.mk: prohibit common grammar error: "all these"

[Jim Meyering]

Paul Eggert wrote:
> On 06/10/2012 12:56 PM, Jim Meyering wrote:
>> Can anyone think of a common way to use "all these" that is
>> not in error?
>
> Yes, lots:
>
>   Tired with all these, for restful death I cry
>      -- Shakespeare, Sonnet 66, line 1
>
>   But Mary kept all these things, and pondered them in their heart.
>      -- Luke 2:19 (King James Version)
>
>   The complaint ... about modern steel furniture, modern glass houses,
>   modern red bars and modern streamlined trains and cars is that
>   all these _objets modernes_, while adequate and amusing in themselves,
>   tend to make the people who use them look dated.
>      -- E.B. White, "Fitting In", The New Yorker, 1934-06-09
>
>   I keep picturing all these little kids playing some game in this
>   big field of rye and all.
>       -- J.D. Salinger, The Catcher in the Rye, 1951
>
> All these examples are perfectly good English,
> and there's no need to remove all those instances
> of "all these" from gnulib.

Hi Paul,

I'm not convinced.
I suspect that some those (sic) instances are exercising poetic license
(Shakespeare, surely) or merely demonstrate that this error is common
in informal speech (Salinger's narrative).

In your opinion, do any those uses in gnulib sound better without the "of"?

What do you think about correcting some those instances?

Yes, there *are* some uses that are ok:

    "All these people need is ..."

----------------------------------------------------
I did a quick search and found this in response to a question:
http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/grammarlogs2/grammarlogs339.htm

  What is the correct way to use "all"? Should a person say "all" or "all of"?

      He moved all the books.
      He moved all of the books.
      All of these files belong to her.
      All these files belong to her.

  ---------------------
  In most constructions, we dispense happily with the "of." However, when
  there is another pronoun (such as "those, those") following the "all,"
  it's probably a good idea to include the "of."

  Authority: The New Fowler's Modern English Usage edited by
  R.W. Burchfield. Clarendon Press: Oxford, England. 1996. Used with the
  permission of Oxford University Press. (under all)