Re: Honoring traditional defaults [was: Transient Mark Mode on by default]

[Mike Mattie]

On Tue, 25 Mar 2008 20:53:53 +0000
Alan Mackenzie <address@hidden> wrote:

> Hi, Stephen!
> 
> On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 07:15:10AM +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> > The only reason not to make Windows/Mac-like behavior the default
> > that makes sense to me is if we think that traditional Emacs
> > behavior is *clearly* superior for *most* beginners, enough to make
> > it worth a short period of confusion and annoyance while they learn
> > to use the Emacs behaviors.  For something as controversial (and
> > deservedly so) as t-m-m, I think trying the change at this stage in
> > the release cycle is a good idea.
> 
> FWIW, I think that the trad Emacs way is clearly superior.  The fact
> that I use Emacs enthusiastically bears this out.
> 
[snip]
> 
> The whole point of this thread is (or, at least, should be and was)
> how the _default_ Emacs looks, what "emacs -Q" gets you.  The fact
> that all of us here can configure Emacs to Alpha Centauri and back
> again is beside the mark.
> 
> I am not worried what TMM will do to _my_ Emacs - it'll make me add
> another line to my .emacs.  I _do_ worry, and worry a lot, that
> newcomers might never come to grok the delightful conceptual unity of
> the Emacs mark - and that their use of it will thus forever be
> inefficient.
> 

Honoring tradition is a very pertinent title for the human side of the issue.
I see it as honoring a *promise* not tradition. When i began to use Emacs
it was hard, even though I was a fairly proficient programmer at the time.

I persisted with Emacs because Emacs was sold to me like this:

* It is insanely hard to learn, but once mastered you will have acquired awesome
  powers and perspective. 

* It might even help you write code faster.

What it actually turned out to be was this:

* It's really hard to overcome the reinforcement of habit in your grey matter.

* Using Emacs to it's full potential carries the price of learning elisp.

* It does make good on it's promise of the Right Thing. Just throw your .emacs 
into RCS
  and let the itch drive the rest.

Why it matters:

So the new user, takes this promise of the Right Thing on faith, dedicating 
themselves, their precious free
time to learning Emacs. They climb the mountain to discover what ? The Right 
Thing wrested from meticulous
thought, passionate debate, and decades of endless polish ?

I certainly hope so, as I was fortunate to receive the bounty of that
promise. As long as there is real value in Emacs - value untarnished by the 
mediocrity of 
consensus and tribalism (cultural habit) - value appraised from a perspective 
that holds better 
or worse as objective measures, refugees will find a home in Emacs.

Does adding T-M-M, CUA mode, and brethren keep that promise or forsake it ?

How terrible a thing to contemplate, a student climbing that mountain only to 
discover yet again thoughtless
concession to the irrational, hows without whys, and design without theme. 

The moment Emacs trades away it's most precious value, neglects it's most 
important promise to a user, it
becomes just another editor.

The fact that Emacs does things different, the hope that the Emacs way is 
better, and the celebration of
creativity in elisp is the Emacs pact with the user.

I hold up viper as an example. Emacs delivered so well on that promise that vi 
people built a emulator for their
editor inside Emacs. Why did they do that ? I think it's because the 
abstractions hit a incredible design
sweet-spot. Buffers, regions, functions, marks, the point etc.

Freedom of Choice:

Unfortunately this world is full of people who are certain they know what's 
better for their neighbor than their
neighbor. Emacs does not need to become theocratic. People should be free to 
create and add what they wish
to Emacs. The core however is *sacred*, the common trust in which we have 
poured our time and minds. Let us
guard it well with reason, keep the promise. We can encourage freedom, 
experimentation, and sharing in something
like ELPA. But keep the promise in the core.

Enabling t-m-m by default is endorsing t-m-m as the best way of editing. Do we 
really think this is the best way to
use emacs ? deserving of the core and privileged default status ? or is it a 
transition path at best ?

Now that is a question for the community.

Cheers,
Mike Mattie

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