Re: Key bindings proposal

[Lennart Borgman]

On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Juanma Barranquero <address@hidden> wrote:
>
>> There were three main things I wanted to work:
>> - Using the windows keys (or other key, for example shift-lock) as
>> Emacs META so that Alt key could be freed.
>
> Why is that *necessary* for Windows users?

Oh, I forget META-TAB too, which is used heavily in Emacs.

>> - Getting sticky keys (accessibility) to work.
>
> Have you filed a bug report about the specific problems in standard
> Emacs vs. sticky keys?

We have discussed it on this list.

>> And once again: I do not consider it a fork. Some people have indeed
>> asked me to make it a fork but I have stayed here, hoping things
>> should change.
>
> It's a matter of definition.

Rather bashing.

>> Please excuse me, Juanma, but I find this a bit annoying. I have
>> explained this several times before here.
>
> There's a difference between "I would like for Emacs to work in
> such-and-such way", and "Windows users do need such-and-such feature
> to feel comfortable with Emacs". Obviously all of your changes fall
> into the first category, but I'm not so sure about the second one. I
> know of a few seasoned Windows users which apparently do not need
> them. So stop trying to conflate both categories.

Have I done that? When? Perhaps you misunderstood something?

>> And I also find it a bit hopeful. Using the right and left windows
>> keys as Emacs META requires that a low level keyboard hook is used.
>> Just read the documentation at MS to see that. (I have given link to
>> it previously.)
>
> Yes, but you need to use the Windows key as meta *because* you want to
> use Alt for alt, and you want to use Alt for alt because some menu
> troubles, isn't so? And the question is, are really these troubles so
> big?

Yes, I thnink so. There is also the trouble with META-TAB.

(And if they are, shouldn't you work to get the keyboard
> handling patch into Emacs... and then we're back to the same old
> discussion).

They are there in my patched version. Just grab them.

>> I would be glad if you (and others) did not try to make other people look 
>> silly.
>
> I would be glad if you (and others) did not try to make Emacs
> developers look like old farts that do not accept your changes out of
> sheer complacency or negligence.

I hope I have not done that. (But I am not responsible for your
answers.) I know time is a big issue, but I have spent a lot of time
on this.