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Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?
From: |
Adam Spiers |
Subject: |
Re: Hushing up Sibelius news? |
Date: |
Thu, 28 Feb 2013 19:28:57 +0000 |
On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 6:13 PM, Joseph Rushton Wakeling
<address@hidden> wrote:
> On 02/28/2013 06:20 PM, Adam Spiers wrote:
>>
>> I strongly disagree, unless your definition of "difficult" ignores
>> the time dimension of such a project.
>>
>> http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000069.html
>
> It can go horribly wrong, yes, but it doesn't have to. Git for example was
> a from-scratch attempt at DVCS -- if Linus Torvalds had started from e.g.
> Arch or Darcs, it's unlikely that we'd have had the innovative DVCS that we
> see today.
That's an excellent counter-example, thanks! FWIW, git is very
roughly half the LoC of LilyPond.
>> Know-how and experience do not enable large, functional code-bases to
>> be magically constructed in short time spans. They help increase
>> velocity and quality, but any new code-base takes a long time to grow.
>
> Yes, but it takes even longer if you begin from the wrong starting point.
> Neither Lilypond nor MuseScore really does what this team seem to be aiming
> for
Well, presumably that's speculation unless you have inside info ;-)
Or did I miss some publically announced details?
>>> but because they are writing a completely new codebase, they do
>>> not have to be constrained by historical mistakes or backwards
>>> compatibility.
>>
>> Nor would they be constrained by these if they started with LilyPond.
>
> Lilypond's existing architecture is a constraint, its existing syntax is
> another constraint. And much as I admire Lilypond, I doubt its design is
> entirely free of mistakes ... ;-)
Sure; my point was that existing architectures can be changed without
a rewrite.
>> Finally we can agree on something ;-) But Daniel Spreadbury already
>> admitted that they haven't even looked at the LilyPond and MuseScore
>> code, therefore they have dismissed the possibility even before doing
>> a technical feasibility study.
>
> Well, of course not. They won't want to risk the possibility of GPL'd code
> influencing what they write. The simplest legal defence against accusations
> of copying is, "I've never looked at that code."
Right, he already said that in his response to me.
> But the bottom line is, their licensing choices and their reasons for
> building a project from scratch are fairly orthogonal.
Maybe; we can only guess what their reasons are.
> Personally, I doubt that Lilypond's design choices fit well with a piece of
> software that's designed to provide real-time WYSIWYG engraving,
Of course there's not a natural fit yet - the most obvious clash being
the number of engravings per process invocation. But things like that
are surmountable through refactoring, and I believe people such as Jan
and the Scorio guys have already worked on solutions to this.
> MuseScore's data structures are likely to be far too limited compared to
> what the former Sibelius team are setting out to do.
Probably, but again, data structures can be changed ...
> It's a shame that the opportunity to do so was taken away from them by a
> firm corporate decision to build a proprietary project,
We don't know that's what happened, do we?
> but I suspect that even with firm backing for a free software
> package, they'd have chosen to start from the ground up.
Sadly I think you're probably right. I think I'll retire from this
thread now, since there's no use crying over spilt milk for longer
than necessary ;-)
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, (continued)
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, Phil Holmes, 2013/02/28
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, Joseph Rushton Wakeling, 2013/02/28
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, Adam Spiers, 2013/02/28
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, Joseph Rushton Wakeling, 2013/02/28
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, Werner LEMBERG, 2013/02/28
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, Adam Spiers, 2013/02/28
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?,
Adam Spiers <=
Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, David Kastrup, 2013/02/21
- Re: Hushing up Sibelius news?, lilypond, 2013/02/21
- Horns example from blog, Jim Long, 2013/02/21
- Re: Horns example from blog, David Kastrup, 2013/02/22
- Re: Horns example from blog, Jim Long, 2013/02/22
- Re: Horns example from blog, Urs Liska, 2013/02/22
- Re: Horns example from blog, David Kastrup, 2013/02/22
- Re: Horns example from blog, Urs Liska, 2013/02/22
- Re: Horns example from blog, Jim Long, 2013/02/23
- Re: Horns example from blog, Janek Warchoł, 2013/02/27