Re: [GNU-linux-libre] review PureOS ISO

[Tiberiu-Cezar Tehnoetic]

On 09.11.2016 19:22, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
> On 11/09/2016 06:08 PM, Tiberiu-Cezar Tehnoetic wrote:
>> On 09.11.2016 18:42, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
>>> On 11/09/2016 05:24 PM, Tiberiu-Cezar Tehnoetic wrote:
>>>> What browser the PureBrowser is based on? What add-on repository
>>>> does it
>>>> use?
>>> It is based on Firefox ESR and it will have two xul extension from
>>> archive (https and ublock). We discovered bug (non-responsive tabs) so
>>> we temporarily removed it from alpha 2 image but we put in firefox-esr
>>> with those two extensions. It will come back with final release (where
>>> we also hope to iron out all the bugs you find and report - again
>>> https://tracker.puri.sm/maniphest/ for reporting bugs).
>>>
>>> In future we plan to diverge a bit more from Firefox regarding defaults
>>> (or they maybe choose to have same defaults so we abandon the
>>> re-branding and avoid their trademark issues (not that it will happen,
>>> but just for our sake)).
>> Please note that the Firefox official repository includes many nonfree
>> extensions. PureOS can't comply with the GNU FSDG if it's using Firefox
>> default repository. FSF and GNU IceCat maintain a list of free
>> extensions for Firefox-based browsers.
> 
> We are mirroring Debian main archive for that and AFAIK Firefox is
> entirely FLOSS, but it allows non-free extensions. It would be a bit
> radical to remove it because users can access non-free extensions - we
> can use lynx to access websites that promote nonfree things etc etc. I
> think many distros used Iceweasel and now will use Firefox if they are
> based on Debian - and again, Firefox is Free software AFAIK.

You're wrong. A browser which proposes nonfree extensions is not a free
browser, the way a GNU distribution is not free if it proposes nonfree
software packages. Needless to say, a system including a browser which
proposes nonfree extensions is not a free system, by transitivity.

If you aim to get PureOS on the list of FSF-endorsed GNU distros, you'd
better take note. This is a blocker, that you are including Firefox ESR
with their default extension repository.

"The system should have no repositories for nonfree software and no
specific recipes for installation of particular nonfree programs."
https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-system-distribution-guidelines.html#license-rules

Also, I hate you are using words like "radical" and "fanaticism",
especially considering your project branding is based on the words
"pure" and "purism". This is an indication of how you view your target
group (us, the freedom-demanding users) and that is why I take offense
in your system/project name. Your system/project is not "pure" in
respect to freedom and you disregard freedom issues when they are
presented to you.

>> https://www.gnu.org/software/gnuzilla/
>> http://directory.fsf.org/wiki/IceCat
>>
>> In my opinion, PureOS should use GNU IceCat instead of Firefox and
>> support (with developers and donations) its development.
>>
>> Moreover, last time I checked Firefox was by default DRM-enabled (by
>> using a nonfree add-on), and that is not acceptable.
> 
> I don't think it is enabled for Linux builds, but at least not for
> Debian ones.

I see. You should check/ask to be sure.

>> It would be great if Purism could join the existing efforts instead of
>> only focusing on rebranding (sometimes without even crediting the
>> projects you are using) and marketing.
> 
> That, again, has nothing to do with our FSF endorsement and about our
> business - in this particular case we want to avoid any chance of
> Firefox trademark "war". Please keep it inside the limits of this
> discussion which is PureOS road to FSF endorsement.

I disagree. What I proposed is that Purism uses and supports GNU IceCat
- there isn't a trademark problem with GNU IceCat. This browser based on
Firefox is endorsed by FSF, and the freedom problems raised are solved
in GNU IceCat. Abrowser is another FSF-approved free browser you might
want to be based on and support.

Again, if your goal is to have PureOS respect the GNU FSDG and endorsed
by FSF, you should take the pragmatical (if the ethics don't appeal to
you) decision to use a free browser like GNU IceCat or Abrowser.

Thanks,
Tiberiu

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