Re: lilypond bug 2368

[address@hidden]

On 28 avr. 2012, at 19:19, Mark Mathias wrote:

Karol,

I hope someone can help you do what you wish. It's definitely beyond my level of expertise. From my point of view on the bug squad, this doesn't look like something that needs to be handled by us, so I'm going to suggest that future correspondence on this issue not be sent to the bug squad.

Thanks,

Mark

2012/4/24 Karol Majewski <address@hidden>

Thank you Phil.

Dear LilyPond friends: Janek, Phil, Colin,

I have another big problem now. I'm trying to find a global setting that
would allow to ignore collisions between ties and accidentals. For me, a
tie-accidental collision looks a way better than a shifted tie - especially
in tied chords in which one of the ties is unnaturaly shifted horizontaly.
I'm almost sure that it is possible to achieve this, but I don't know how.

Best wishes

PS Janek, I saw that report. I really appreciate your contribution :)

Hey Karol,

One difficult-to-document feature of LilyPond ties is the details list.  For example, if you do:

\override Tie #'details #'vertical-distance-penalty-factor = #1000

it'll make certain vertical shifts very unlikely.

I've copied the details from define-grobs.scm below.  There are a couple other details that for the moment are just used internally.

There's been a lot of back and forth on a few LilyPond lists about improving ties.  I'm of the opinion that the system in place is sound (it is a similar system as that of slurs and beams), but what needs improvement is an understanding of how much factors are worth and where they make the difference.  We've made some headway in slurs in 2.15 by removing unnecessary factors and decorolating them but we haven't been able to do the same yet for ties.  So, my advice to everyone would be to play around with this details list.

The more we know how the details list functions in real music, the better we can make it.  User input matters: if you exhaust all combinations of details and it still doesn't work, then it's much easier for a developer to know how to modify the infrastructure.  Furthermore, if you find a cocktail of details setting that leads to a result that, in your opinion, should be out-of-the-box, then it's helpful to know that as well.

Cheers,

MS

        (details . (

                    ;; for a full list, see tie-details.cc

                    (ratio . 0.333)

                    (center-staff-line-clearance . 0.6)

                    (tip-staff-line-clearance . 0.45)

                    (note-head-gap . 0.2)

                    (stem-gap . 0.35)

                    (height-limit . 1.0)

                    (horizontal-distance-penalty-factor . 10)

                    (same-dir-as-stem-penalty . 8)

                    (min-length-penalty-factor . 26)

                    (tie-tie-collision-distance . 0.45)

                    (tie-tie-collision-penalty . 25.0)

                    (intra-space-threshold . 1.25)

                    (outer-tie-vertical-distance-symmetry-penalty-factor . 10)

                    (outer-tie-length-symmetry-penalty-factor . 10)

                    (vertical-distance-penalty-factor . 7)

                    (outer-tie-vertical-gap . 0.25)

                    (multi-tie-region-size . 3)

                    (single-tie-region-size . 4)

                    (between-length-limit . 1.0)))