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RE: Recentish C-s M-y change
From: |
Drew Adams |
Subject: |
RE: Recentish C-s M-y change |
Date: |
Fri, 1 Jan 2021 11:10:51 -0800 (PST) |
> > More and more (my impression), things, even major
> > things, are getting changed through just bug reports.
> > Dunno whether that's intentionally to avoid wider
> > discussion, but it has that effect.
> >
> > I share that impression as well, it does seems that the modus operandi
> > is to change first, discuss later.
>
> I think this impression might be skewed. Many people feel the
> opposite: that we discuss too much, and moreover, that starting a
> discussion on emacs-devel almost invariably leads to stalemate that
> blocks the proposed changes.
Sounds to me like you're rather confirming my
impression - just expressing (skewing?) it a bit
differently.
Someone who wants to make a change and not risk
discussion that involves actually _proposing_ the
change, and that might lead to the change ultimately
not being agreed to, may decide to do an end-run, by
"fixing" a "bug" instead.
We all know here that discussion on emacs-devel does
NOT "invariably" lead to stalemate that blocks changes.
There can in fact be no "stalemate", because we have
a decider - you. Instead of stalemate, end-runners
might avoid a wider discussion that ends with your
decision to "block" the change. (A decision I'm
often in agreement with, FWIW.)
> If someone wants to be intimately involved in the Emacs development,
> he or she should subscribe to the bug list, because many issues are
> discussed there (as they should be), and sometimes the conclusion is
> that we should make changes.
Of course. Issues. And even new feature requests.
But as mentioned, lately there have been some
pretty _big_ changes made that way.
It's a judgment call whether something should be
discussed in a bug thread or on emacs-devel.
My impression (and it's only that), is that more
and more some are choosing to do the former -
perhaps, as you suggest, to avoid a wider or longer
discussion, which might involve greater risk of
counter-arguments or push-back.
> It is impractical to expect that every potentially
> annoying or problematic change will be detected
> before it is committed, so I urge people not to
> develop such unrealistic expectations.
I don't think anyone has such expectations. This
isn't a black-&-white thing. It doesn't help much,
I think, to hypothesize expectations of "every"
this or that.
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, (continued)
RE: Recentish C-s M-y change, Drew Adams, 2021/01/01
Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Lars Ingebrigtsen, 2021/01/01
Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Alfred M. Szmidt, 2021/01/01
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Eli Zaretskii, 2021/01/01
- RE: Recentish C-s M-y change,
Drew Adams <=
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Richard Stallman, 2021/01/02
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Eli Zaretskii, 2021/01/02
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Richard Stallman, 2021/01/03
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Eli Zaretskii, 2021/01/03
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Richard Stallman, 2021/01/04
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Eli Zaretskii, 2021/01/04
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Juri Linkov, 2021/01/04
- Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Eli Zaretskii, 2021/01/04
- RE: Recentish C-s M-y change, Drew Adams, 2021/01/04
Re: Recentish C-s M-y change, Richard Stallman, 2021/01/03