RE: [Heartlogic-dev] rumination prototype

[William L. Jarrold]

On Mon, 9 May 2005, Joshua N Pritikin wrote:

> On Sat, 2005-05-07 at 15:40 -0500, William L. Jarrold wrote:
> > ...one more thing.  it did not seem to remember my login, ohl1.
>
> Yah, the  database is entirely new.  We can copy only logins later.

You said "We can copy only logins later."

I will assume this was a typo that you meant to say

"We can copy older logins later."

..else please clarity

> > also, after my first visit, i could not revist the website and try to
> > redo the ratings.  it said something like "there are no more ananymous
> > studies."
>
> Hrm, it should reset after an hour.  I wonder if I should let it recycle
> after 1 minute, just for testing.  Maybe I'm being overcautious.

Yes one minute good for now.

> > i even had a friend, stephanie, create a username, pasword.  she loged
> > in but still could not fill out the basic "vienna is wet." type
> > items.
>
> Hrm, I guess I should add a rating screen for people who are logged in.
> I don't have that yet.  Coming soon ...

whatever. not hurry.  get the content and look correct first.

> >   how about while we are in alpha test mode we allow people who
> > revisit the site to submit as many ratings as they please.  this seems
> > like the best way to try lotsa stuff get in depth feedback from me and
> > also some friends as i sit over their shoulder and watch them.  yes no
> > maybe?
>
> Yes.
>
> > we also played around with the submit story thing (url
> > http://ohl.nirmalvihar.info/?leaf=submit_story;session_id=27).  not at
> > all clear what should go in the "Name" boxes under Topics...
>
> I changed it to "Goal Topics".  Is that more suggestive?

Probably yes.  Schank and Abelson refer to "Goal Themes."  Maybe that
is what you mean?

I forget the details of the interface.

Maybe there should be a fixed set of goal topics for them to chose from?
I dunno what research question you are asking.

> In the Jack & Jill story, the only goal topic is "a pale of water".

why not "to fetch a pale of water."  after, there are hundreds of
thousands of pales of water inthe world at any time instant.  This
basic fact about the world does not make Jack and Jill happy.  For
them, the goal state was that Jack and Jill were playing the agent
role in a fetching of a pale of water event.  Or maybe the goal is
that they possess a pale of water.  Fetching is a plan put in to
action to achieve that goal.

Goal topic is a very fuzzy notion.

To argue the other side, why isn't the goal topic water, or a pale or
a liquid or a container or an artifact or...I could go on.

> > I tried to submit a story "jack and jill went up a hill to fetch a
> > pale of water.  jack fell down and broke his crown and jill came
> > tumbling after."  it is unclear what to put into the name type-in
> > boxes under Topics.  And it is not entirely clear how that story maps
> > onto "introduction", "goal formation and expression" and "goal
> > matching and evaluation."  you can see my best guess.
>
> You guessed correctly.

Wow, that's refreshing.  Usually when I use a web interface I feel
frustration confusion....Okay okay don't get me started again. (-;

> Actually it is not really crucial to use one of each of "introduction",
> "goal formation and expression" and "goal matching and evaluation."

Good.  Simplify and get rid of it then.
"Less is more." (-;

> My goal type study is only concerned with "goal formation and
> expression".  The kind of stuff in your dissertation falls under "goal
> matching and evaluation."  The "introduction" category is just catch-all
> for random suppositions.

Well what is goal formation?  Is it how did Jack and Jill come to want to 
fetch a pale of whater or what?

> Maybe I need to copy this explanation into the story editor?

Yes!!!.  Best to put a one to two sentence defintion.  And then give
some clear cut examples.  Then give examples of things that are NOT
examples but might be considered near misses of what is goal formation.

I also am asking the same questions about goal expression.

> > also unclear what "choose file" is for.
>
> Pictures!  Yes, you can tell your story in comic book form!

Clarify with explanatory text.  E.g. replace "choose file" with 
"choose picture file" or "choose image (jpg, gif, etc) file."

> > whatever, maybe you did not intend for me to semi-seriosly puruse
> > this.
>
> No, actually I'm psyched that you tried it out.  ;-)

great.

we are moving!!

btw josh i agree with you that the bot turing challenge thing
is a cooler idea.  but it seems to me a little hard to implement.
i still want to do it.  so lets keep working on it.  maybe i chose
this rumintation pilot as my top priority bc it was easier.


bill

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