RE: [Phpgroupware-developers] Communication ... again (was PHPDoc s for head)

[Dave Hall]

Kai,

I am replying here to correct some factual inaccuracies.

On Wed, 2005-04-20 at 11:13 +0200, Kai Hofmann wrote:
> > That's probably because I don't trust Kai.  
> 
> The same for me - I don't trust Dave.
> 
> > Kai has a habit of running
> > his own race. 
> 
> The same as Dave,
> for example a commited an inclomplete and dangerous
> port of fudforum, 

I did a quick review of the code, and involved others.  I also checked
with others before making such a commit.  At the time of the commit
there were very few active people to test the code thoroughly before it
went into cvs.


> he wants to put complete new stuff
> (email, calendar) into 0.9.16 - where a feature freeze was.

Sorry?  I don't know where you got that from.  Instead of spending my
time running "php -l" (something which is have a script to do
recursively for me), I have been writing a new communications app, which
is sponsored.  The application will be completed shortly.  I am
proposing that the app is released as an (officially) unsupported
application as part of the the 16.x release, this was done with sitemgr
and the idots template set in 14.

Calendar?  I have plans there and some potential funding sources, I
choose not to discuss this matter in a public forum, if anyone wishes to
contribute to this effort email me off list.

> Also Dave has crashed the phpropuware.org server by
> forgetting to run lilo ...

Simple mistake, major impact - sorry.  There have been other factors
which have led to server down time over the years. 

> 
> This list is much longer ...

Ok, lets start listing them shall we.  Don't just include the fsck ups,
lets list the things achieved.  Lets compare that to the list of things
you have done/fscked up Kai.

One of those would have been being one of the first developers to try to
have a civilised discussion with probiz.  I also took time out of my
holidays to have such a meeting.

> 
> The difference is that dave always did big bad things ...
> and always is hacking on me who did small things that
> bring the project a step ahead.
> 

Would that include spending 3yrs almost full time one managing the
project?  The 100s of hours of free support I have given users?  The
100s of hours spent discussing ideas?  The 100s of hours dealing with
bugs and (sometimes poorly written) patches?  The time spent in
meetings, the time spent furthering the project.

> > There are many other people who make valuable contributions to the
> > project.  They consult before doing anything which may have an impact,
> > or run things by people. 
> 
> I remember that you have aknowloedged to import a new contacts backend
> that was not completly tested after a feature freeze.

No it was before the feature freeze.  It was not properly tested,
despite assurances from the author.  The contacts backend was needed,
and yes it still has a little way to go, but so be it.  The new backend
is there, it is great - I have very few regrets about it.

Shall we bash ceb for commiting Thorsten's (probiz employess') work
(which was paid for by probiz) work on filemanager?  This was something
supported by probiz, long after feature freeze.  There are other cases
during the 16 RC cycle i can find too.  Looks like you need to call a
glazier to your glasshouse.

> 
> > I think a public discussion about the setup changes fips is proposing
> > should also be on this list, not via phone calls and private email.
> 
> Thats correct and I have told fips to mail something about the changes,
> because without this no one would know - also I told him that
> this was not a good idea ...

Looks like you have little or no authority in the office.  I can ask
fips to do something as a friend, he can refuse, I can ask him to do it
as a project admin, he can refuse.  You can ask him as a more person in
a more senior position, he has less options.

btw this is not a bash probiz issue, it is a basic team work issue.
Fips is well aware of my position on this stuff.


> But when it works and is backward compatible is is in my eyes not such
> a big problem it head. I agree that discussiong an api change before
> would be best - and thats what I told fips.
> But this is different from fixing bugs in php or xhtml code as well
> as adding docs.

You are still missing the point.  To me there are only subtle
differences between this and your xhtml changes in 16.  What worries me
is that you can not learn from your mistakes.  This is a real problem
for me and IMHO is should also be for the project.

> 
> > Either work (and communicate) as part of the team, not your own little
> > faction that thinks they can do what ever they want.
> 
> The same for you.

I have no faction.  I spend a decent chunk of time discussing things
with a lot of people.  You would be surprised.  I do not always do it in
a public forum, as it is not always appropriate.

I prefer IRC and email where I can talk to many people rather than long
distance phone calls, it cheaper and more effective.

Cheers

Dave
-- 
Dave Hall (aka skwashd)
API Coordinator
phpGroupWare
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