Re: Ties within chords inconsistency

[David Kastrup]

Simon Albrecht <address@hidden> writes:

> Hello David,
>
> pardon if I insist another time.
>
> Am 09.09.2015 um 22:40 schrieb David Kastrup:
>> Joram <address@hidden> writes:
>>
>>> Hi Simon,
>>>
>>> I see. The difference is: I would not have expected that to work. But I
>>> can see the benefit if it would, now.
>> Sigh.  It works perfectly.
>
> Of course it works as long as you keep inside the current way of
> distinguishing in-chord and whole-chord ties. But, as I already said
> earlier this day, ‘this means reconsidering the relation and the
> handling of in-chord and whole-chord ties’.

It means no such thing unless you have built your own misconception of
what << >> means.

> I do not doubt your authority in interpreting the way LilyPond thinks,
> but I have been using LilyPond for four years now and invested no
> small amount of time into understanding how it works. My point is that
> we shouldn’t be insisting on striking internal logics too much, if any
> user who has not delved into the exact internal workflow of the
> program will encounter problems with code that is perfectly sensible
> /on the surface/.

If you don't understand simultaneous music, don't use it for things for
which it is not really intended like avoiding chord notation.

> To return to our particular topic: the distinction between ‘ties
> inside simultaneous music expressions within one voice which will be
> arranged into chords only later’ and ‘ties within chords’ is very
> subtle and far away to the musician(*). I can unfortunately not speak
> about technical feasibility, or rather difficulty, but how about the
> following approach: Any tie which is not attached to a chord in the
> <>~ manner is interpreted as in-chord tie. This would shift the
> preference from whole-chord tie to in-chord tie for ‘doubtful’ cases
> like a~ (as opposed to obvious cases like <a~> or <a>~), so to
> speak.

In-chord articulations stick a _lot_ closer to the notehead and
consequently do worse collision avoidance.  It is generally wasteful to
employ them when one only has a single notehead at one point of time.

> (**) Nobody would expect the tie in
> \new Voice << { c''~ c'' } { a' a' } >>
> to mean a whole-chord tie, that is two ties for both c and a.

One typical use of parallel music is assembling notes with an
articulation track which results in something like

<< { c'' d'' e'' f''} \tag #'articulations { s-. s s-< s-! } >>

and ~ is a construct of the same kind even though less likely to be
employed conditionally.

-- 
David Kastrup