Re: [Gnu-arch-users] OT: trained dependency

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

>>>>> "Zenaan" == Zenaan Harkness <address@hidden> writes:

    Zenaan> Stephen, you called into question what I was saying. So I
    Zenaan> decided a few links and quotes would be in order, to
    Zenaan> "defend" my own point of view. If you have not been able
    Zenaan> to fathom my point of view, then perhaps I need to learn
    Zenaan> to express myself better.

You've missed the point.  Hint: I understand your point of view.  I
even share important parts of it.

    Zenaan> And I believe that any of a number of alternative school
    Zenaan> systems [...] are significantly better than the compulsory
    Zenaan> system we have.

Well, I'd like to believe in Santa Claus, but unfortunately that
doesn't put toys in my daughter's stocking.  There is plenty of
evidence that home schooling works very well indeed---if the parents
are reasonably in tune with the world around them (B. F. Skinner was a
"home schooler") and quite motivated.  Dunno what a "Steiner school"
is.  "Self-education" is gangbusters (and if you're lucky you can even
pick up some gold stars from the conventional system as you pass Go),
but again requires substantial motivation, this time on the part of
the student.  Apprenticeships ... to sorcerers, maybe.

The fact is that even if learning is what you do for fun, learning is
hard work.  Given the wide variation in sex drive among my
acquaintances, I'm quite sure that learning drive is equally variable.
I see no reason that a human being with median or below on the
learning drive scale is likely to acquire the competences that are
his/her birthright without teachers.  There's a reason why the word
"education" has a root that is cognate to "educe".

While that doesn't imply that the current schooling system is a good
thing, it does make me want to know what you're planning to replace it
with that is _systematically_ better.

    Zenaan> You are already a product of the last century of
    Zenaan> systematization. You don't (speak at least) get past your
    Zenaan> assumption that results must be measured, and presumably
    Zenaan> that results actually measure intelligence.

No.  I am not a product of the last century of systematization.  I am
me, 1% original, 10% due to my parents, 20% influenced but not
determined by the last century of systematization, and 69% by turns
arrogant, ornery, and downright nasty.

As for intelligence, intelligence is the product of the CIA, MI6, KGB,
and other TLAs, and given that association, I'm sure you will agree it
really is hardly worth worrying about.  People are what they are, they
do what they do, and in the process every single one of them has
extended the range of human capability in some way, and deserves to be
honored for that.

Results?  Results measure results, that's all.  This _is_ useful; all
serious athletes own stopwatches (or other appropriate measuring
instruments), you know.

    Zenaan> but try to see that these assumptions are exactly that,
    Zenaan> assumptions,

I do.  I recommend to you that you try to see your assumptions about
my model of the world as exactly that.

-- 
Institute of Policy and Planning Sciences     http://turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp
University of Tsukuba                    Tennodai 1-1-1 Tsukuba 305-8573 JAPAN
               Ask not how you can "do" f